I know devs and Cm's visit here

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But the lack of info given to class forums, especially admittedly low representative success in arena class forums is beyond laziness

(As I posted in another thread in General.)

Information isn't coming right now for many things people are asking about. But, we still have things in the works that don't just focus on any one class. And we're saying that because our focus isn't on any one class right now but on all classes as well as the future of World of Warcraft given the work we are doing on Wrath of the Lich King.

My days are a bit busy right now and will continue to be for awhile, as will it be for all of the team, but we're keeping tabs on as much as possible while working on other projects too. It isn't laziness, though I understand that's your perception since a lot of what we do is not visible to you. It's about timing. When we have information, we have permission to share it, and it's the right time, we will be posting it. We do continue to read the forums and keep up on everything we can in the meantime.

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in before the mass of shaman posts consume your soul Neth

Edit: Because i cant spell consume :P

Some might say I have none to consume. ;)

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Where have you guys been since 2.4 went live?

Let's just say, I'm often amazed that not only is it already Thursday of this week, but it's April. We really have been very busy with many projects and are doing what we can to make sure we still get some time in with the community as well.

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Well yer a female, so that's a given. :)


Edit: I hope you take that the way it was meant, just a joke :)

Sleep with one eye open! ;p

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It'll make me shut up for a while.

Heaven forbid! It's people talking about things that just confirms that people still care.

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many projects, so many that time flies by so quickly, yet not so many as to actually address problems that have been around for so so long?

You're making the mistaken assumption that we aren't working on things. We definitely are. Addressing concerns from the community is a part of the current and ongoing development. That's not to say that your every idea will reach fruition exactly how you envisioned it. It's to say that we have been reading, have our own ideas, and will be doing plenty of testing to find something that works for the health of the game overall. (Which includes the health of the classes as always.)

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While we have some attention


why are 2.4 concerns still stickied?

Because it still has some relevance. If you feel that there needs to be a newer thread with a better collection of data, please feel free to create one. I can always unsticky that one if you (the community) feel that it isn't as relevant now.

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Welcome to hell Neth, The Blizzard team created it and now there going to burn in it, and no you cannot "Freeze" it over this time. Haha I just made a blizzard pun. :D

But no really there are a LOT of angry players about to post, so get used to it.

I've been around game communities for a long while. I've been baptized in fire many times over. Does it make it a more pleasant experience? Not really, but it's not unexpected for some to feel it necessary to go beyond constructive.

As for other questions on whys and hows of Arena balancing etc, I can't really answer that for you. Keep in mind, we're not into Season 4 yet nor have we announced a date for it. I know there is a lot of discussion over the latest information on the ratings, but it's hard to say more about what the outcome will be or how class changes will affect gameplay once they are added in with Wrath of the Lich King. Also keep in mind, changes will affect those that don't purchase the expansion as well and there are many details yet to be worked out in that regard. We're moving up to level 80 and much like moving up to 70, it may change how people spec, what their personal game goals are and more.

Our best hope and wish is that when we get into those changes, people will continue to post their feedback and help us to continue to make the game better at every opportunity we get. I know people will believe this to be a sales pitch or a white wash, but I don't say things lightly. I'm looking forward to what is to come and would like to hope others are too. I just want to do my best to help everyone keep changes in perspective as much as possible.

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I don't get it, are you saying that season 4 will not be released till WoLK? Otherwise why are you equating the 2?

If not then it sure looks like a nice way to dodge the issue by instead focusing our attention on upcoming changes(as you<blizzard> have done for the passed 3 years).

I'm saying that we don't have a time of release for Season 4 yet. It will be before Wrath of the Lich King, however.

On any other changes planned prior to the expansion, I believe we've said before that we have no plans for additional class changes until the expansion. We are still applying fixes in the meantime. (class or otherwise)

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So you completely dodged my question of why some classes are so worse off yet are held to the exact same PR standards as those classes that have it much easier, bummer.

On top of all that you're saying nothing will change till I pay you<blizzard> for the expansion? That's a pretty sad statement considering the current state of the shaman class, what we've been put through and the lack of attention we've received all this expansion(60-70). So you're saying "Pay us again, it'll be better this time I promise"?

You missed the part that the changes will affect everyone the same as it did with the Burning Crusade changeover. You will have access to the new talents and abilities to level 70. That's important to keep in mind. It will not require you to purchase the expansion to have access to that. Although, anything beyond level 70 will require the expansion.

As for the worse off question, it's a bit subjective to say some have it worse off. What you're asking for is a handicap of sorts.

I'm all for continuing to read this thread provided the discussion doesn't continue to spiral into personal attacks on me or attacks on other Blizzard Employees.

For the person that felt the need to "summarize" the conversation, please note at no point did I mention myself as being female. That was someone else that brought it up.

As always, there are those that are happy to at least see our presence and there are others that don't want to see us at all unless we are bringing a feast of information. I'd rather be visible when I can. But again, there is a means for providing constructive feedback and suggestions for the Community Team at wowcmfeedback@blizzard.com should you wish.

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Interesting.. So basically what you're saying is when the ptr was up.. and we suggested feedback on the ptr realm.. got told to go to the General forums then have it deleted from there and were told to post here on our class forums.. you're telling us to go somewhere else now?

COME ON Neth.. What is wrong with you?

Just own up to the fact that you guys messed up and didn't want to bother listening to us when we were simply doing "constructive" posts when you asked us the first time.

This is in no way shape or form our fault. You guys dropped the ball and yet are trying to shift the blame back on to the customer? NICE.... Very.

The really good threads that basically told you guys how and what you should look into were deleted from every forum. You know this.. All the cm's do because that's the reasoning for the dot shocks.

Now you're telling us to send feed back to that email address? Get real Neth.

I think you're confusing game feedback from Community Team performance feedback in this case.

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So Neth, while your around, I got a few questions.

The main one being: Are you planning on releasing the the 51 point talent trees prior to Wrath like you did prior to Burning Crusade?

Secondly: pie or cake?

Given that at some point we'll be testing Wrath of the Lich King, I'm going to go with the idea that we will be releasing more information about the talents prior to the release as a sure thing.

I like pie. Preferably blackberry or apple.

Devl, you remind me very much of Darshnar, who I actually have enjoyed talking to. Although, after reading back through some posts, I'm not sure which questions you were looking for answers to, so I'm answering a few different ones below for everyone. They are not the answers people are looking for right now, but they may help a little.

• Shaman in Arenas, the most I can do is refer to Kalgan's post on this.
  
• Updates to the Shaman Class specifically- I couldn't say. I can say we have no plans for major class changes, but that won't preclude any other changes the developers may feel are necessary prior to Wrath of the Lich King including fixes for things they feel need adjusted.
  
• I'm trying to answer what I can, but at this point, there isn't a lot I can share other than give some information on what we're working on in vaguer terms than many people would like. As you know, we're working on the 2.4.2 patch as you can see on the PTR as well as working on the expansion.
  
• Details on when the content for WotLK will be released or if it will be released prior to the expansion are yet to be announced.
  
• Feedback to the Developers is ongoing. Whether we have the time to post or something to post or not, we are reading still and passing information on.
  
• It's important to remember we do pay attention to feedback, but feedback does not mean there is an agreement for change. It is relayed, however, and goes into the Developer's hands for them to determine if there is something that works within the game to alleviate the concerns associated with the feedback or not.
  
• We'll do our best to get information out once we are given permission to do so.
  

Eltek, I'd ask that you refrain from attempting to make conjectures about my work ethic. If you feel you have valid feedback you can use the email that was provided. I'd also like to ask that people please refrain from swearing or engaging in personal attacks either against myself or others participating in this thread. Thanks.

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So i was wondering Neth, if you, personally think shaman are either not properly balanced, or are lacking in comparison to other comparable classes?

Is there any other possible ways that shaman can convey their ideas besides through the forums, because up until now, even with this slight bit of hope, are not very efficient. I am not saying you nor anyone are not doing their jobs, but I think its evident that the shaman community has several issues, which are not being dealt with specifically.

I don't really share personal views when I can. It lends itself too much to people believing that it represents the company's viewpoint.

The best ways to convey ideas and experiences is via the forums, the PTR forums, reporting bugs, and even playing how you play, etc. Our information comes from internal and external sources so we are weighing and balancing ideas constantly for the game as a whole.

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The only thing i can't understand is why the CM's are still around after all that kind of stress.

Because we love what we do and the benefits far outweigh any negatives. I genuinely like getting to take part in the community and I get the benefit of working for a company that I thoroughly enjoy working for.

I too started as an FPS player and yes, remember the first days of the genre. I cut my teeth on what it was like to be a part of an online community there once there were online communities.

As for how long everyone will have for Season 4 prior to the release of the expansion, I couldn't say. We do not have a time frame just yet that we can give anyone. We still fully intend to give a 2 week notice prior to the release of the season however, like we did with the last ones.