Regional FlagDid blizzard really think we could do it?Source
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Croosh
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#0 - 2008/03/31 07:49:09 PM
To raid with the normal WoW UI interface? Without any mods? Without threat meters? With just how the game came out of the box? Did they really expect people to get through MC without any addons?

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Blue Poster
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#6 - 2008/03/31 08:05:34 PM
No, I think we assume that those who are working on the extreme endgame PvE content are going to be doing anything they can in order to help increase their chances for success. By both embracing the UI mod community and their addons, as well as assuming that players are going to be using them to great effect versus our encounters, we have to design encounters that assume their use or the encounter is trivialized by those on vent, those with a countdown, those with a threat meter, etc. Once a lot of the guess work is removed with mods we have to raise the complexity beyond what a mod can purely assist with. I think at this point we're forced to assume everyone is using mods to great effect versus our design complexity, which in turn forces everyone to use those mods. It's probably somewhat debatable what mods are required and where, but it's certain that we have to take them into account, lest the game be trivialized.

UI Mods have become an integral part of the game for many players, and we've been extremely pleased with the amount of customization and information they're able to provide. We're continually working to assess and implement new UI features, many of which have come straight from the community, to help ensure that the default UI is as full featured as possible while remaining uncluttered, clean, attractive, and easily approached.

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Blue Poster
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#38 - 2008/03/31 08:34:02 PM
Q u o t e:
The one thing I'd really wish to get from WoW UI is a a dimming effect if people are out of range of heal spells


Check your Party & Raid interface options, post 2.4. It's currently set to a distance that almost all cure/heal spells use, and doesn't take into account the specific spell or talents which may extend your reach.

Q u o t e:
I think some simple mods that should built into the UI would be a threat meter, atlas loot and maybe a damage/healing meter.


Well, as I said we're continually looking for little bits here and little bits there to throw into the default UI. I don't think we're going to be at a point, at least for a long time, where we think "Ok, that's about all we need, everything else they can get themselves."

The biggest ... "issue" we run into when implementing a new UI feature is ensuring it fits with the simplicity and approachability of a default UI. For larger and more intrusive features I think the best thing we can usually do is provide a solution that fits into our idea of what we want the default UI to offer, but at the same time give mod makers new options and more information to grab on to, parse out, and create better mods for those that want to customize their UI even further.

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Blue Poster
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#48 - 2008/03/31 08:41:50 PM
Q u o t e:
Too much fluff and eyecandy and not enough information - though which is improving, slowly as I said. Square portraits to fit into the corners properly, moveable frames - a all-in one backpack and removal of pointless clutter on the main action bar would be a help.


Those all sound like personal taste, and a reason why we fully support a user's ability to download and install a mod that helps to alter or modify their interface to their liking (as long as the mod falls in line with what is allowed according to our legal agreements of course). We have a specific idea of what the default UI should look like, and offer, and if you want to change that then we want you to be able to. Enjoy and embrace the fact that you can change it.

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Blue Poster
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#53 - 2008/03/31 08:53:25 PM
Q u o t e:


Thanks for the reponse Drysc.
Why haven't the devs implemented a coordinate system yet? It's pretty much a requirement now when trying to locate anything. Not that I'm complaining, I like exploring. But anytime someone asks, "Where can I find XYZ?", it's never, "He/She/It's next to X". You're guaranteed to see a pair of double digit numbers separated by a comma as the answer. I'd consider something like this a "little bit". :)


Coordinates, as well as some of the other mods that have been discussed or are actually in the process of being implemented, run into the ... again, issue of fitting into the default UI.

We want the default UI to be a part of the game, to blend into the idea of what the game is, what it represents, how you're interacting with it. There's a stark balance between game aesthetics, and function.

"Mignon rides to the top of the hill, his fur matted with the blood of those that fell before him. As he reaches the crest of the peak, he unrolls his map, wipes off the lens of his compass, and sees two sets of numbers hanging in the air - wildly fluctuating - as he moves his finger over the map."

The biggest challenge is making these types of features work in a way that we find acceptable within what we want the UI to portray. Sure, maybe eventually those weird numbers that magically change on your map is something we eventually just have to implement as an acceptable loss to the immersion of the game.

The continuity of the UI probably isn't something most of you really think about, but we're constantly attempting to maintain it with the features we do implement.

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Blue Poster
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#58 - 2008/03/31 08:59:01 PM
Q u o t e:


Drysc, pitbull, ag or xpearl?


I've tried them all, I'm just done with all the crazy layout changing mods. I don't find they actually improve my ability to play the game, and I generally don't find anything I'm able to get out of them worth the immense time and effort I've spent trying to make something useful.

I'm all about the stand alone, simple, "designed to do one thing, and one thing well" type mods. Looking at my screen you'd definitely think there was a lot of extra stuff going on though.

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Blue Poster
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#81 - 2008/03/31 09:23:47 PM
Q u o t e:
Ok not to QQ here, but I'm going to QQ. I run the game with zero mods and have since a virus wiped out my computer a year ago. So now what I'm reading is that the designers are figuring that I am playing with said mods and since I'm not I'm at a handicap to just the basic game design now. Ok I'm acutally fine with that.

But if Blizzard is figuring that a given set of mods are in use by the majority of the gaming public can they put a listing of which mods they are assuming that people are playing with, that way we can at least level the playing field.

I understand not having them on the Blizz site for issues of copyrights and usage royalties, or direct links to download them as they might contain trojans. But just a listing of the names would be nice then I can go find them myself.


I think what we're mainly talking about here are threat meters, and unless you're involved in end-game raiding situations you don't need one. And if you're involved in end-game raiding situations it's likely you would already be aware of those mods your guild uses and relies on. If not then ask them what they use or recommend you use, of if they feel it would even help to the overall progression for you to have them.

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Blue Poster
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#90 - 2008/03/31 09:28:38 PM
Q u o t e:


Drysc, considering fights like Gruul and considering how every server seems to be having a tank shortage (and we could argue all day about whether this is due to dps specced tank classes or whether its due to the pain of pick up groups) why isnt a threat meter being looked into? Its such a core game mechanic but we as players are completely blind to the truth of how much threat we're putting out. We're forced into lowballing our DPS assuming that we cant do much more without pulling agro or the more common approach seems to be DPSing wildly with little or no concern for threat. The inclusion of a threat meter in the default UI would be such a vast improvement for the ease of tanking with pick up groups and for getting the most out of your DPS. I understand that there is a certain amount of realism you have to maintain and we certainly dont have a way to gauge how angry someone is IRL by looking at a bar or meter, but isnt the tiny price in realism worth the enormous gains to the grouping aspect of this game?


I never said we weren't looking into implementing a threat meter, in fact I think at BlizzCon it was specifically mentioned we were looking into implementing a threat meter.

However, our implementation of a threat meter wouldn't be nearly as robust as what everyone is using now, but what it could help do is provide more accurate information to those mods that could use it and parse it out for everyone that wants greater control over it.

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Blue Poster
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#109 - 2008/03/31 10:13:34 PM
Q u o t e:

I find every CM that's ever mentioned mods says the same thing. It seems odd that every Blizzard employee that talks about mods prefers not to use them. Is that a company line, or just a statistical oddity that you all happen to like the default interface?


If you want to re-read the text of mine you quoted you'll see that I stated I use a lot of mods.

Q u o t e:
I ask because the default interface is terrible. There is zero innovation in it.


Yeah well, that's just like, your opinion, man.