change to the item level dungeon entry system needed...

#1 - Jan. 13, 2011, 11:43 p.m.

at the moment it makes no sense guys im so pissed off now, I finnaly got the item level to enter heroics......ive been running them for the last 2 days with no problems no luck with drops yet but ive been performing well, 1st or 2nd dps usually.....I logon this evening to try and run some more for my daily badges etc..........to find i can no longer enter them.....why you may ask? because my item level has dropped to 323 from 330.......this puzzled me as i havnt changed any of my gear what so ever, in fact my item level should have gone up as i bourght the level 346 offhand sword with my justice points to replace the level 313 mace i did have in offhand.....so i asked in guild if anyone knew what was going on here and I found out the reason....

....you know why my item level dropped? because I had 3 peices of bloodied pyrium armor in my bag and it was these items which were boosting my item level.....hell i didnt even know armor in bags effecting the figure and you know what blizzard this is retarded........what your telling me is im ok for heroics if i have 3 peices of pvp gear that actully lower my dps if i put them on instead of pve gear and these peices are in my bags not even on me.......but if i get rid of them im suddenly incapable of running a heroics? how retarded a system is that? the items in question 1. were not even equipped, and 2. are pvp items so should actully lower my item level in a pve setting if the system works the way it should do.

any chance of a rethink on this? im pretty pissed off now that my only option to run more heroics is to either 1.wait for a couple of lucky drops in normal runs which could take god knows how long or 2. spend gold to buy the pvp peices back only to have them sit in my bag and not even be used, this is even more frustrating when I think that I was actully handling myself fine in heroics with the gear I currently have, putting out 10-14k dps on a regular basis.

but no I cant run them anymore because I dont have these useless pvp set peices in my bag to carry around......tell me thats not working as intended? why the hell should armor you dont even have equipped effect your ability to run content? let alone pvp items in a pve setting? simply retarded!

Wryxian

Community

#10 - Jan. 14, 2011, 1:44 p.m.

If you feel you were performing fine in heroics but no longer have the required gear level to queue for a random LFD, maybe try the old fashioned method of creating a dungeon group yourself. Group up with some of your friends and guildmates instead, and then just walk right into the dungeon entrance rather than using the LFD. You might only need to do this a few times till you get your gear level up high enough to use the LFD again.

Alternatively you could recreate the situation you had before, and just keep some higher item level gear in your bags or bank so you can use the LFD tool again. Yeah, it feels kinda sneaky, but if you're confident that your performance is fine and you know your health is high enough to take heroic damage, then this might work for you. The gear item level check for the LFD is very simple, and it's also simple to circumvent. Yes we could make it more complicated, but at the moment we're fine with how it's working. We're not currently very concerned that some circumvention is possible, because this can be useful in some cases.

Sure, I can see you're also a bit frustrated that you need to get your item level up to be able to get back into LFD heroics again, but that's part of the way gearing up goes. If you're not happy using the alternatives of keeping gear in your bags or walking directly into the dungeon entrance, then gearing up through the traditional method is the way to go.

Wryxian

Community

#17 - Jan. 14, 2011, 2:34 p.m.

14/01/2011 2:17 PMPosted by Lunkentus
So if there's an Swedish 12 year old, imature, NINJA Paladin who have "needed" (stolen) all cloth gears from healers, dps, ALL cloth carriers and THEN get into a HC, without the right experience, and the atitude to be in a HC. And then that little Kid will/can ruin for thousands of good, serious players who want to discover the content in the raids Blizzard have given us. Please fix this "bug".

If someone circumvents the gear level check to get into an LFD heroic but is actually unable to perform as needed -- perhaps due to being completely inappropriately geared or inexperienced as in your example, then groups are still able to vote kick that player out if need be.

Wryxian

Community

#22 - Jan. 14, 2011, 3:19 p.m.

14/01/2011 3:05 PMPosted by Kha
The problem with this method is that he will just underperform the next time he is in a dungeon group. And that means the next group have to vote kick this player to. And so it continues.

The trouble with the example is it's quite extreme. The description paints a player who seems to be going out of his way to cause issues for others. Most cases of people circumventing the gear check are doing it for only a few items and only when they're certain they can perform.

14/01/2011 3:05 PMPosted by Kha
Also, you can't queue for random dungeons still, even if you make your own group and travel to the instance yourself. Most players want to do that random for the extra benefits.

True, making your own full group and entering the dungeon entrance directly does mean you miss out on the daily dose of Valor Points. But you'll still get the chance of gear drops from bosses and Justice Points to help upgrade your gear, and in time you can replace any non-ideal gear you've either equipped... or not.

14/01/2011 3:05 PMPosted by Kha
I cheated myself into heroics, but I still think it's a poor implementation of ilvl to have gear in bags/bank count towards your avg score.

Funnily enough, much like the original poster, my first visit to LFD heroics was because I unwittingly had some tailoring crafted PvP gear in my bags still, from leveling tailoring. I was surprised the next day after disenchanting that I was no longer able to queue, but I soon figured out what it was.

Thing is, if we really wanted it to be a harsher gear check or a more complicated system, we'd change how it is and implement another.

Wryxian

Community

#29 - Jan. 14, 2011, 4:09 p.m.

14/01/2011 3:41 PMPosted by Arriel
Sneaky? It's abuse of the system.
It’s hard to believe that you're advising him doing that.

Check out Ghostcrawler's latest blog entry here: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/blog/1690800#blog

To quote him, "The item level requirement is intended only to keep out players who have no idea what is appropriate content for them. We know you can game it by getting PvP gear or hiding off-spec gear in your bags. Congrats on being sneaky! If you’re sophisticated enough to try and game the item-level requirements, you should be sophisticated enough to know if you can actually handle the content."

Wryxian

Community

#30 - Jan. 14, 2011, 4:11 p.m.

14/01/2011 3:46 PMPosted by Malcovas
It is a totally retarded system Wryxian. What is the point in an Ilvl cap if it doesn't do it's job properly. Either remove it or fix it.

While you're of course entitled to your own opinion, the system does clearly show what kind of gear level we're expecting people to have before entering an heroic. If for any reason someone doesn't have that gear level, and their skill or the skill and gear of their group members can't make up for their lack of gear level, then they might encounter issues in the heroics.

Wryxian

Community

#40 - Jan. 14, 2011, 9:52 p.m.

Thanks for the feedback, folks. If you did take a moment to check out Ghostcrawler's latest blog, you'll see we've already thought of some other ways we could possibly alter the gear check to make it smarter or to require you to do the normal version first, for example.

We're well aware that the gear level check can be and is circumvented both unwittingly and in a somewhat more sneaky way. While we don't outright advocate doing this, until such time as we change it to be less easy to dodge it, it's still something that is possible to do.

As I first suggested, the best way to enter an heroic if you don't have all the gear necessary but you do have the skill and ability, is to join up with friends and guildmates and enter the heroic directly through the dungeon entrance.