Is this game for the devs or the customers?

#1 - Oct. 17, 2016, 11:42 a.m.
Blizzard Post
Taken from the US Forums.

http://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20749846886

Just rewatched the Q&A and I have to say it feels like the devs think this game is their private playground and we're paying a monthly fee to simply get admittance.

It's clear as crystal that how the customer base at large feels about class balance and other issues isn't as important as how the devs perceive the game on a completely subjective level.

They aren't only ignoring the playerbase where our enjoyment is concerned (although that should be enough for any entertainment business model) but even when presented with cold mathematics they lift their noses and spin excuses for keeping things how they are or even making them worse.

Blizzard thinks their pimp hand is so strong that they can do anything and we'll still feed them our cash by the shovel full.

My sub expires in February. I wish it wasn't paid out past 7.1 though.

When it ends it ends. For the first time in ten years I'm going to let it lapse and walk away.

P.S. I feel the same way about Overwatch which has as many balance issues as WoW if not more.


Completely agree. For too long this game has been the personal playground for developers who favor the classes they play.
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Community Manager
#36 - Oct. 18, 2016, 12:39 p.m.
Blizzard Post
I'll actually quote the two posts made in that thread as I've noticed not all the fansite Blue trackers have picked these posts up yet.

The first post is by Ornyx which describes the development philosophies within Blizzard:

Game design is most definitely an art, and the artist is the one in control of their own hand.

One of Blizzard's oldest philosophies has been to build worlds and games that we ourselves love, and, only then, inviting players to join us on adventures within. This doesn't mean we don't care or listen, it just means that we do disagree at a philosophical level about some things that players may not like.

Everyone who has worked on Legion has put tons of love and sweat into building this expansion. We are most definitely working on making Legion the best expansion WoW has seen - and I think that will show over the coming months.


Ion Hazzikostas also took the time to contribute to the thread regarding class balance and some of the comments mentioned during the Q&A:

I think the big problem is the balance discussion in the QA came over a bit high handed or even a touch meanspirited.

While it is likely not exactly as it was intended, the whole 'we know yall need buffs but if you become the top spec it will upset the peole who play that spec so no love for you' impression taken from the QA was sort of crappy, especially for people playing Elemental or Frost - who also dedicated a lot of time and AP in the hopes that they would be buffed not to be better than Unholy or Enhance, but on par.

Sorry to hear that it came across that way.

Just to be clear, I was trying to explain why we sometimes may seem conservative or slow with balance changes. Frost mages were used as an example of a spec that we do feel is currently lagging behind in raid and dungeon gameplay, but not by nearly as much as data from public log sites might suggest. It seems less disruptive to buff a spec incrementally, allowing time for the results of each change to play out and repeating if needed, rather than risking overshooting the mark. (And yes, we definitely have failed in this goal at times - post-launch rogue spec balance comes to mind.)

At the heart of balance concerns is the fact that people just want to be able to feel like they have a place in the endgame as their preferred class/spec, and we entirely share that goal. Class balance is an ongoing process, with new variables coming into play all the time, as item level increases, new trinkets, legendaries, and set bonuses enter the mix, players get deeper into their respective artifact trees, theorycraft evolves, etc.

The Q&A didn't delve into specific details because the exact list of changes is and was still evolving. There will be a new 7.1 build on PTR very shortly, and patch notes to follow. That patch contains some improvements for several of the specs that currently are currently underperforming (including both flavors of Frost). Those changes should in general move things in the right direction, but we'll be continuing to watch and adjust further as needed.
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#118 - Oct. 21, 2016, 4:01 p.m.
Blizzard Post
21/10/2016 13:09Posted by Axelstorm
one dev plays fire mage, so that has to be uber strong, no dev plays elemental shaman so we pretend that specc doesn't exist. etc


Considering the WoW development team consists of hundreds of people, it is very likely that there is at least one person on the team playing your class and spec. I think a lot of people are misinterpreting, or even twisting, what Ornyx has said.

While the developers have their own philosophies, vision and game design in mind, they ultimately want the end product to be something that players will enjoy. This does not mean that any feedback to the contrary will be disregarded. Even from as early a stage as when we enter Friends & Family testing with our products, the products can change quite significantly based on the feedback received. However, if the changes would compromise the overall vision, then the developers may disagree with making those changes. That doesn’t mean that they don’t care for, or appreciate, the feedback.

To use the restaurant example that comes up quite a lot in this thread:
If the developers were chefs, they wouldn't want to open a restaurant serving food that they would not be willing to eat themselves. However, they are only human and sometimes a dish isn't served to perfection, a mistake gets made, or a dish needs a little bit more preparation than others. Sometimes a dish simply requires a little bit of salt…

To tie this back into the ongoing concerns about class balance, we've recently received some information about philosophy and potential changes for Outlaw Rogues and Havoc Demon Hunters.

However, if your class and/or spec isn't mentioned there it doesn't mean that we are ignoring you. We're collating all the feedback we're receiving and forwarding it on. I realise it's frustrating to be left waiting but please understand that if we receive any information we can share with you, then we will of course share it with you.

21/10/2016 13:33Posted by Testora
WQ´s are great, but they stop progressing at 850, Crafting is great, but it also stops progressing at 850 + it requires mythic dungeons, HC dungeons don´t offer progress, LFR doesn´t, non rated BG doesn't ...

There are so many things that don´t work, as you guys don´t put effort into them. You serve them to your playerbase in such a way, that they must get the impression, that you don´t care about them, but only your own kind - the raiders and mythic dungeon players, as this content is what you do as well and therefore put lots of effort into.
The re-design of Kara, damn it´s great, but it´s not accessible by the majority of your players, therefore they can never see how much work went into it and this is a problem.

What your team needs is a casual, who does not raid or do these dungeons, someone who is telling you every evening in the office, that he has nothing meaningful to do :) I am sure this would change things to the good.


We have some new content coming in Patch 7.1 tailored toward solo-play as well as some changes coming to non-rated PvP that should make it feel more rewarding.

With the recent changes to emissary caches to give gear more in-line with rewards from World Quests, it is possible to get up to a gear level comparable to that of mythic dungeons without even setting foot in a mythic dungeon. You still have chances for those rewards to Warforge or Titanforge and be on the same level as rewards from higher difficulty Mythic Keystone dungeons. In this regard, gear is more accessible than ever before.

We've been seeing a lot of requests over the years for more organised smaller group content, this originally took the form of Challenge Modes and has since transitioned into the current Mythic Keystone system. Base mythic dungeons are fundamentally designed around a level of communication and co-operation that automatically match-made groups often lack.

Organised group content that requires commitment should have a reward that correlates to the investment required. This is why higher difficulty dungeons and raids have a more consistent chance of providing a more powerful reward when compared to hoping that the 830 World Quest reward will Titanforge up to 860+, but either way no matter which content you do, there is still a chance that you're going to get an upgrade.

Karazhan holds a special place in many players’ hearts because it's an iconic location in Warcraft lore and was one of the first truly accessible raids for players in terms of the number of players and co-ordination required, even when compared the 20 man versions of Zul'Gurub or Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj in classic WoW.

At BlizzCon, and through talking to fans, I've often heard stories of friendships and guilds that were formed and blossomed as a result of Karazhan. By making Karazhan a mythic dungeon it allows us to attempt to re-capture that spirit of Karazhan by promoting more organised, smaller group, play again.

Like I said in this thread, I don't think it's inherently bad for World of Warcraft to offer solo-experiences, but on the flipside I don't think it's inherently bad for the game to offer organised small group activities either. One of WoW's strengths has always been the breadth of content if offers for different playstyles.