The Future of the Rogue Class - More Feedback

Just as a quick follow-up for you all, I don't have anything new I can tell you at this point in time. When we do have something we can start talking more about with you all, we will. We have many things in the works and they are all contingent on other things so until they are more solid, we just can't talk about them.

I'm just curious as to how many rogues that are being ousted by groups are being ousted by a rogue in control of the party that doesn't want to compete for gear? I've heard that's been a pretty SOP for some rogues as of late. Most people I've talked to lately have also said despite the feeling that Druids out dps rogues that rogues are still at the top of their lists for someone to not only sap but to scout and dps the heck out of things. I've even heard of druids not wanting rogues in their group so that THEY can get the gear as well. Is this something others are running into as well that may be shaping the perception by some that they are being excluded from groups because of their class? (It's just an honest question folks. I'm not trying to imply that no one has been discriminated against for the reason they believe. Just saying there may be more to it than that. Don't slice and dice me.)

Are there specific dungeons that you all are finding difficulties in? We're keeping an eye on Heroic Mode Dungeons for instance.

What I'm saying is mostly that the more specific people can get on what they are encountering the better. It's sometimes difficult to discern if someone just isn't as skilled at their class as someone else or if their group make-up was off or if there is a genuine imbalance that needs fixed so othe more information we get on what people are encountering the better.

It's good to know things such as why people are choosing the classes for the groups etc. I've noticed that when I've run in pugs I've come across some strange perceptions of what "can" and "can't be done. Of course I've always been the type to take a "I can find a way" sort of tact on things so am a bit pushy when I come across those types. I just expect them to step up and get the job done. For instance (and not to drive the conversation off in a new direction) when I play my healer and I have a rogue in the party, I tend to assume my need to heal them will be relatively minimal and maybe a shield might be needed but that's all. As a rogue, I know there are many ways to manage aggro if there are competent tanks working that end of things. I expect people to pretty much do their jobs essentially. So I just wonder how many people are creating groups based on bad experiences versus what they know a particular class is capable of. (Hopefully that makes sense.)

I'm enjoying reading the various insights here so please continue to do so.

Q u o t e:
"I tend to assume my need to heal them will be relatively minimal and maybe a shield might be needed but that's all. As a rogue, I know there are many ways to manage aggro if there are competent tanks working that end of things"

Your kidding me right, there are insane aoe damage and dots only for those in melee range. No amount of agro management is going to stop .

There are things for that called hots and shields and ways to strip off magic and curses etc. Hots stack now too so anyone in the group with it can stack it. Of course any healer knows that in an AoE situation they can't expect a rogue or anyone else to fend for themselves completely. I'm talking about in a 'normal' situation against a mob not an AoE situation. Although we're getting off the topic because we could debate healing vs aggro vs dps vs whatever else for days on end. ;)

Q u o t e:


Rogues take up too much healing and offer nothing in heroic mode instances. Too many 360 degree cleaves and AoEs. Why bring a rogue when you can bring in a ranged class and not have to deal with a mana sponge.

Our DPS should be higher than any hybrid (or non-hybrid if they have heals they shouldn't DPS like a pure class) Or else give rogues/warriors healing like a feral druid (if they can DPS like a pure class then I wanna heal like and off-spec healer, it's only fair.)

Areas that need improvement are:

1 Weapon skill fix it.
2 Group benefit (Sap is NOT a group benefit nor is opening chests)
3 DPS
4 Survivability
5 Did I mention DPS


The reason I'm saying DPS is when a druids, shred HITS harder than my SS for the same enegry something is broken. SS needs to have a % modifer added to it and up'd added damage bonus. There is no reason this is unbalanced. If they can regularly hit for 1k+ shreds why can't I hit for 1k+ SS?

Thank you for listening to us.

Could you give specific names of Heroics you've found that in?

That's an interesting point Dek. I can tell you personally, I love having rogues in the group and when I play a rogue, I love that 'freedom' feeling you get from knowing you don't need to worry about mana or anything else other than ripping your target to shreds (yes, I'm oversimplifying a bit.)

I can tell you when I play as my priest I love the feeling of having a rogue in a group (non aoe multi-healing madness situations) because I know they will rip things to shreds and not need a ton of healing.

I wish I could say more about what more is to come but don't want to build up any sort of overinflated expectations and also don't want to give out anything we're not prepared to give out. I CAN say that we've always wanted to make sure all classes feel included in parties and rogues are included in that. We just have to be very careful about just how we go about it all.

I would also like to say I appreciate everyone's thoughts and the conversation this morning.

Q u o t e:


yes neth, agro control totaly helps on bosses/mobs with chain cleaves, thunderclap, aoe stun+dmg stomps, self-centered damage auras, and thorn-like abilities, which are plenty abundant in my experience in BC

/boggle

Pssst... Did you read where I basically said excluding AoE situations? ;)

/bonk