Constructive Feedback: Patch 2.4.3 Shamans

#0 - July 16, 2008, 6:09 p.m.

Here is the post made by Push ( top raited enhancement shaman of US)
As an Enhancement Shaman devastated by the change to Fel Armor and Ice Armor, I am confused, outraged, and helpless.

When the Armor change went into the PTR, many coherent, polite posts were made outlining how much this would destroy Enhancement Shaman. My two threads got deleted, and my Shaman was banned for spamming/trolling, even though all I did was articulately supply feedback on the PTR Forum, where feedback for PTRs is supposed to go.

Blizzard says the best way to offer opinions and suggestions is to post on the forums. Over the last years, I've made tons of threads about the state of Enhancement Shaman, offering constructive feedback and reasonable ideas. I'm sick of following the process Blizzard wants--it has gotten crap for results.

This post is my last resort: I want these buffs. That's it. If Blizzard isn't going to create their own buffs to balance Enhancement Shaman in PvP, I'm going to tell them what to buff, because I'm honestly sick of just getting ignored and waiting for third-rate buffs that don't even keep up with other classes.

Two of the following three buffs should happen as soon as possible:

- Toughness reduces the duration of movement impairing effects by 50%.
- Ghost Wolf breaks movement impairing effects (only available for Enhancement)
move it deep into enhancement tree
- Stormstrike has a 25% healing debuff on it.

---

Sorry for my tone of my voice, but I'm disgusted with what is going on right now, shocked that Blizzard would let something like this happen.

Just to clarify, I don't have a problem with other classes getting buffed, especially Mages and Warlocks. I have a problem with Blizzard buffing other classes and ignoring Enhancement Shaman, or in the case of 2.4.3, buffing other classes at the expense of Shaman...

As far here comes the link http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?forumId=10021&sid=1&topicId=7903839424&pageNo=1&

Now i rly want to ask the same question for Blizzard why other classes gettting buffed by the same time destroing other class pvp ( shaman/priest) shaman already nerfed into the ground.The work should be done now,not waiting for WOTLK to come out, shaman had suffered from TBC and keep going worst and worst with each patch,if you want to remove the class from the game do it now and offer people other class to play,but if not FIX shaman,make them to be avarge class not the bottom one

Nethaera

#20 - July 16, 2008, 6:32 p.m.

Q u o t e:
Here is the post made by Push ( top raited enhancement shaman of US)
As an Enhancement Shaman devastated by the change to Fel Armor and Ice Armor, I am confused, outraged, and helpless.

When the Armor change went into the PTR, many coherent, polite posts were made outlining how much this would destroy Enhancement Shaman. My two threads got deleted, and my Shaman was banned for spamming/trolling, even though all I did was articulately supply feedback on the PTR Forum, where feedback for PTRs is supposed to go.

Blizzard says the best way to offer opinions and suggestions is to post on the forums. Over the last years, I've made tons of threads about the state of Enhancement Shaman, offering constructive feedback and reasonable ideas. I'm sick of following the process Blizzard wants--it has gotten crap for results.

This post is my last resort: I want these buffs. That's it. If Blizzard isn't going to create their own buffs to balance Enhancement Shaman in PvP, I'm going to tell them what to buff, because I'm honestly sick of just getting ignored and waiting for third-rate buffs that don't even keep up with other classes.

Two of the following three buffs should happen as soon as possible:

- Toughness reduces the duration of movement impairing effects by 50%.
- Ghost Wolf breaks movement impairing effects (only available for Enhancement)
move it deep into enhancement tree
- Stormstrike has a 25% healing debuff on it.

---

Sorry for my tone of my voice, but I'm disgusted with what is going on right now, shocked that Blizzard would let something like this happen.

Just to clarify, I don't have a problem with other classes getting buffed, especially Mages and Warlocks. I have a problem with Blizzard buffing other classes and ignoring Enhancement Shaman, or in the case of 2.4.3, buffing other classes at the expense of Shaman...

As far here comes the link http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?forumId=10021&sid=1&topicId=7903839424&pageNo=1&

Now i rly want to ask the same question for Blizzard why other classes gettting buffed by the same time destroing other class pvp ( shaman/priest) shaman already nerfed into the ground.The work should be done now,not waiting for WOTLK to come out, shaman had suffered from TBC and keep going worst and worst with each patch,if you want to remove the class from the game do it now and offer people other class to play,but if not FIX shaman,make them to be avarge class not the bottom one

I appreciate the post and I don't have any specific answers for you now. As you know we've been in a holding pattern on some things and are focusing more on bug fixes and adjustments (aside from Wrath development) of which some may have application toward what we're working on in Wrath of the Lich King. While I understand the frustrations when seeing other classes getting changes that might be considered larger than just a fix or nerf, we aren't doing class reviews or revamps. Most of the big changes you are going to see will come as a part of Wrath of the Lich King.

For now, I can say what we've been telling a lot of people, your feedback is noted. Hopefully when we get into the beta, we'll see a lot more solid feedback from everyone who gets a chance to test. Just keep in mind that if we don't implement something you feel is necessary, that there are reasons for it or we just don't agree that it's the best possible option at that time.

I understand the frustrations of people wanting things to happen before the expansion, but in order to do that we end up delaying its development and many things are very intricately woven together within the development.

Nethaera

#52 - July 16, 2008, 6:48 p.m.

Q u o t e:

Translation: Nothing is going to be done. My question is, if you appreciate such feedback, why were Push's original thread posts in the Feedback forum deleted and his Shaman avatar temp-banned?

You'd have to contact the moderation team about that via the email address in the topmost sticky. I couldn't answer that for you and this isn't the best location for discussing that. Sorry.

Nethaera

#73 - July 16, 2008, 7:02 p.m.

Q u o t e:

Neth, I want to preface this by saying I have nothing but respect for you for being a calming voice of reason and moderation on the chaotic, backbiting boards.

However, there is an inherent disconnect in what you are saying. Either classes should have a moratorium on changes to the function of their class abilities, or they are still open to change. What seems to be happening is that there is a tweaking of classes that are easy to adjust. Warlocks are very solid, having few, if any, issues to be addressed in PvP or PvE. However, the Devs felt they would augment their abilities even more because it was easy. However, these easy augments to solid classes only serve to widen the deficit with distressed classes.

Moreover, the recent adjustment to rogues suggests that Devs are very able and willing to make substantial changes to some game mechanics. If they are willing to do this for/to any class, they should be open to doing it for all classes.

Either changes need to stop until the Xpac, or they need to be equitably distributed. You cannot (fairly) have it both ways.

Classes are always open for the potential of change. Some (as you mention) might have an easier time being tweaked. Others might be undergoing more vigorous changes that can't be done in small bits. I could talk about sunshine and rainbows for everyone, or I can try to make sure people are aware that we don't have sweeping changes planned right now and anything big is going to come in Wrath. Some changes can be made now as a precursor to Wrath and as a part of the development for it (or simply as needed fixes or adjustments), but that doesn't guarantee all that much for the now. Development doesn't stop for us even when it may seem like nothing big is happening yet.

No one class is out of sight out of mind and I think once we get way into the beta, many people will be able to start experiencing what we have in mind and can start giving us feedback on whether we're hitting or missing with our plans.

In the meantime, nothing is going to stop people from continuing discussions on the forums ( unless they are violating the Forum Guidelines or Code of Conduct that is) and we are still doing what we can to read and keep on top of things.

Waiting is always the hardest part, and we're looking forward to getting the expansion out to everyone to test and then play. I know I'm personally looking forward to it.

Nethaera

#94 - July 16, 2008, 7:17 p.m.

Q u o t e:

neth, can shamans get a straight answer as to why they dont get any fixes until months down the road? Suffice to say, nobody expects any positive changes to be made, but failing that, it would be a nice gesture to at least explain to them the logic behind doing nothing for them.

If we can share more on what our plans are or general ideas of why we are doing certain things, we will. Right now, there isn't a lot that can be said. I hate to say it again, but I think once we get into testing Wrath in the beta, more will become apparent on what is changing and the community will start seeing the whys in there as well. If they aren't then we'll be encouraging people to share their thoughts on the beta forums so we can take a better look at it all.

No matter what happens, there will always be someone that feels we didn't address everything to their liking (that goes for any class). The Development Team is working very hard to advance all of the classes within the game as well as advance the game itself. In order to ensure the overall health of the game, some things that may seem like popular ideas may not be implemented because they just won't work in the overall scheme of things. Sometimes the answer is, "yes" and sometimes it's, "no" and sometimes we can't share the reasons completely for the nos without revealing something else we aren't ready to talk about and sometimes the reasons are obvious.

As always, we will do what we can for everyone to keep giving out information and sharing what we can with you.

Nethaera

#102 - July 16, 2008, 7:22 p.m.

Q u o t e:

Don't blame me if i throw this back in your face later on after WOTLK. Sound good?

It wouldn't be the first time. ;)

Nethaera

#159 - July 16, 2008, 8:04 p.m.

Q u o t e:
Hey neth you realize we are playing BC and WOTLK hasnt been released yet, right?

I'm interested in the game I paid for, not the next game you want to sell me

We're talking about the same thing. I assure you. Wrath changes tie in the same way BC changes tied in. Changes to classes up to 70 will be available to everyone (that has BC and those with original WoW to 60 from BC) who doesn't buy the expansion. (This excludes Death Knights, new areas, dungeons, Northrend, and anything post 70 essentially same as with Burning Crusade.)