MMO-Champion BlueTracker - @GC.. Why nerf Deep Wounds?

2009-01-08 21:00:09

Why not simply move it down the Arms tree.

Seriously, I don't understand WHY you wold gimp arms warriors more, where is the LOGIC.

Ugh.

- a very frustrated warrior

[ Post edited by Nethaera ]

Alaradie

2009-01-08 21:18:27

Re: @GC.. Why nerf Deep Wounds?

Deep Wounds is causing too high a percent of damage for Fury and Arms, 20 or 30% of total damage on some fights, and often above white attacks. Since it is unmitigated damage we are eventually going to have balance problems here if we don't already.

Fury is slightly high in PvE, or definitely will be after these TOO [sic] changes. Arms is too low in PvE, which is why I said we wanted to buff them.

We like Deep Wounds' position in the tree. We're fine letting all warriors reach it. It's just too good.

Ghostcrawler

2009-01-09 09:15:13

Re: @GC.. Why nerf Deep Wounds?

Q u o t e:
Im seeing a lot of posts about the Deep Wounds nerf. I love my warrior a lot and this does indeed worry me. I searched patch notes on World of Raids And MMo Champion and read a thread about it on Tankspot etc etc. I can't find any numbers. Is there no numbers for it yet or am I just totally oblivious.

Let me back up here. We have not nerfed Deep Wounds yet. We are talking about it. Players saw a nerf to Sudden Death and asked why we would nerf Arms without nerfing Fury, since Fury seems to be dominating Arms in PvE and Arms is not dominating Fury in PvP (not that we want one or the other tree to be the PvE or PvP tree anyway). I responsed that we wanted to adjust dps warrior dps by making Deep Wounds less of an overall contribution of warrior dps, buffing Arms in PvE and possibly PvP, and either keeping Fury the same or slightly nerfing them for PvE.

Longer term, I think the real key to fixing some Arms (and Fury) issues is to take a hard look at stances. But those are beyond the scope of 3.0.8.

Q u o t e:
They're basing 20-30 percent off encounters like Thaddius/Lotheb/Malygos where you get ridiculous damage buffs as parts of the encounter

Some of you keep saying that, but we actually do understand how the encounters work. We made them, remember? :) Several other warriors are telling you it is a large percentage of their damage on all fights, not just the ones with unusual buff mechanics (upon which it is even larger).

Q u o t e:
Ghostcrawler this nerf will hurt most warrior tanks too.

It will hurt a lot of them, though honestly their dps seems pretty decent and nobody is having trouble on threat. We will compensate Prot if we need to. Deep Wounds should not be a "mandatory" talent for Prot, though honestly this conversation did not start because of Prot.

Q u o t e:
This. It's pretty obvious to me that Deep Wounds presents a serious scaling issue that will prevent any real warrior changes in the future. Honestly Titan's Grip is still hugely OP, scaling wise, even after the Deep Wounds change

This is our POV on both talents. We suspected TG would be too good, and resisted changing in for a long time in despite of so many claims that Fury would never be able to compete with the hit penalty on it. At this point we are going to just balance around TG rather than nerf it.

Q u o t e:
However you are wrong saying that fury gets "two buffs" in the patch.

I was referring to TG losing the remainder of its penalty and the WW glyph. They are minor buffs to be sure, but I think many players are scratching their heads about why we would nerf some of the top damage-dealers but buff Fury. The answer is that we aren't done yet.

This is where someone cheerfully says “You should buff everybody because that’s more fun.” Suffice to say inflation is a real issue if we only ever crank numbers upwards.

Ghostcrawler

2009-01-16 12:45:46

Re: @GC.. Why nerf Deep Wounds?

I think some people aren't reading the entire thread, because I said way back there somewhere....

Q u o t e:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Q u o t e:
They're basing 20-30 percent off encounters like Thaddius/Lotheb/Malygos where you get ridiculous damage buffs as parts of the encounter
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

GC: Some of you keep saying that, but we actually do understand how the encounters work. We made them, remember? :) Several other warriors are telling you it is a large percentage of their damage on all fights, not just the ones with unusual buff mechanics (upon which it is even larger).

We don't want to nerf Deep Wounds without increasing Arms damage in PvE and PvP to compensate. We have not made any changes to Deep Wounds so far.

I repeat: Deep Wounds is not a Thaddius / Loatheb issue. You can stop saying that now. :)

Ghostcrawler